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1984 Nissan won't turn over
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mtnstyne
New User
Nov 10, 2007, 5:24 PM
Post #1 of 4
(3438 views)
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1984 Nissan won't turn over
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My 1984 nissan 4x4 720 p/u (Z24) has an electrical problem.
The symptom is that it starts about 50% of the time. The times it does not start it doesn't turn over at all (no response or sellenoid clicking). It can be push-started and it runs fine. I have had the starter, alternator, and battery checked at parts stores. It also does not start when attempting to jump it from another car. Usualy after push starting the vehicle it starts the next few times without incident and it has happended both with the engine cold and hot. There was one incident where it seemed to turn-over weak, but started.
- Voltage while running is around 14-15V and while off the battery reads 12V.
- I replaced the lead from the battery to the starter and cleaned the ground cables.
- I checked all the fuses and they are not blown.
- Fuseable links are intact.
- It is a 5 speed manual transmission, no neutral safety switch.
I am trying to figure out where to look next (ignition switch, inhibitor relay, ingnition module?) It is dark now so in the morning I will be pulling out the key ignition switch and seeing if I can figure out anything with it. Also plan on taking out the fuse panel and cleaning all the connections.
I have a basic knowledge of electrical application and can read a schematic, if I had one. Appreciate any help.
(This post was edited by mtnstyne on Nov 10, 2007, 7:11 PM)
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mtnstyne
New User
Nov 11, 2007, 3:10 PM
Post #2 of 4
(3429 views)
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Re: 1984 Nissan won't turn over
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Follow-up on Testing:
- Power at the starter seems normal (new 2 guage lead from battery for main power, tested the smaller connection that attaches to the soleniod and it shows 12V when the key is turned to the start position)
- Cleaned all the fuses and connection at fuse box and tested with a multimeter. All appear to be working normal.
IGNITION SWITCH TESTING
- Used the multimeter to test the ignition switch (key ignition switch). Didn't turn out as I expected, but I am not sure how it is supposed to work.
- There are 4 wires to the switch. One of course is hot and I assumed the other 3 switched to hot as the key is turned. Turns out that 2 switch to hot as the ignition is turned, and the last one is hot all the time. This didn't seem right to me, but like I said I am not an expert.
HOT WIRING ATTEMPT
- Tried hot-wiring the truck by turning the ignition switch on and connecting a hot wire on a toggle switch directly to the smaller connection that attaches to the solenoid with no results. Did not turn over or click.
- Next tried to hot-wire the ignition switch under the dash. I disconnected the 4-wire plug and used a jumper wire to connect the 4 wires in order of how the switch would. Same result as above...just crickets chirping.
I am now willing to use a toggle to hot wire the truck if it will work, but not having luck with that either. Any ideas? It is dark again so looks like another night of sitting in the hotel room watching football. I will probably take this to a mechanic tomorrow, the only thing I can think of is that the starter solenoid is in fact dead and that it just "happened" to test OK that time at the parts store.
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DanD
Veteran
/ Moderator
Nov 12, 2007, 6:13 AM
Post #3 of 4
(3423 views)
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Re: 1984 Nissan won't turn over
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Thanks for the PM but I thought I would answer here in the forum.
The wiring diagram I have for this truck isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on, no sense posting it.
In this case I would be using a simple 12-volt test light, while checking for powers at the solenoid.
A test light requires amperage to light the light, where a high impedance voltmeter does not need current flow to show voltage.
Let’s say that the problem with the truck is a bad connection that will only allow 100th of an amp current flow. A voltmeter will still show you source voltage, giving you the impression things are ok. An everyday old style test lights needs an amp or more to light the light; if this ‘bad” connection or whatever it is (switch?) only allows a very small amount of current flow, the light isn’t going to light.
Test this like you have been; with the ignition switch held in the start position; clip the ground strap for the test light right to the solenoid case and the probe to the small terminal of the solenoid.
If the light doesn’t light move your ground to the engine block; if the light now lights then it’s an internal solenoid issue. Again if the test light doesn't light keep moving back through the circuit with the test light probe until you find where the light will light?
If the test light does light, we’ll go on with doing voltage drop test across the main cables.
The one thing I could make out on the wiring diagram is that it shows a clutch interlock switch on the pedal assembly. Designed to force you too push the clutch pedal to the floor completing the starter circuit. Maybe have a look there on the clutch lever assembly; someone may have disabled it and now their “fix” may have failed
Let us know what you find.
Dan.
Canadian "EH"
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mtnstyne
New User
Nov 12, 2007, 4:15 PM
Post #4 of 4
(3419 views)
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Re: 1984 Nissan won't turn over
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I'll start from the bottom up: You are correct that there is a clutch safety/interlock switch on the clutch pedal, and it has been bypassed or has never been hooked up from inception. Impossible to tell, but it is not connected and I can't locate the wiring harness for it.
Bought a test light about 2 hours ago, was looking for an ammeter but did not find one I was willing to buy. Have not yet tried it out.
I'll run you through my day:
1. Woke up and went outside to try and start the truck...nothing.
2. Checked all the connections again for Voltage only (no test light yet) at the ignition switch as well as at the solenoid. All checked out good.
3. (as described by the Haynes repair manual) Took the lead off the S connector. Used a screwdriver to try and jump the circuit accross the solenoid - IT TURNED OVER. Tried it again - IT TURNED OVER AGAIN.
4. Reconnected the lead to the S connector and tried to start the truck...nothing. Tried to jump across the S connector again and nothing.
At this point I was waiting for a ride to buy a test light so I figured why not try something else.
5. Removed the starter and went back to my room...disassembled the solenoid as far as I dared and cleaned all the connections.
6. Checked resistance from the negative post on the solenoid to the body of the starter and it had a good connection.
7. Took the starter back down to the truck and reinstalled it. Turned the key and...IT STARTED. Turned it off and turned the key again...nothing.
8. Tried to jump it across the solenoid again and nothing.
My ride showed up and I took the starter back to the parts store for testing again. It passed once, then twice, then a third time,...then failed....once, twice, three times. The guy hit it with a large wrench a couple times...it passes again. Then fails again...
Anyway, I ended up buying a rebuilt one, reinstalled it (can do so in about 10 minutes) and 3 starts in a row and no failures at this time. I'll post again if it fails, but I am hopeful that the problem is simply just a bad spot in the starter.
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