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jeepdave
New User
Dec 17, 2014, 3:27 PM
Post #1 of 12
(2110 views)
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turn signal issue
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I will try and be as clear as I can.
1999 Fleetwood tioga (ford e350)
I turn my signal to turn right and it flashes quickly.
Checking all my bulbs I found the rear right not working.
My parking lights all worked except for the same right rear.
Changed all bulbs.
I checked voltage at the left rear bulb and got readings of: 0 volts, 9 volts, 0 volts and so on in time with the flasher.
I checked the right rear and got readings of: 0 volts, 0.3 volts, 0 volts and so on in time with the flasher.
I fixed the right rear parking light by identifying a loose ground and corrected. ( this whole light cluster utilizes the same ground)
So. I began chasing the brown wire that operates the right rear turn bulb, checking before and after any connections and kept getting the same really low (under 1 volt) voltage readings. I checked as far as I could find the wire to just behind the drivers side front door. One this is where I lose the wire, and at this point I'm assuming that the wire is just burnt up. So where do I go from here? How and where would I change this wire? Do I start with the fuse box? The steering column? I'm guessing the wire goes to these points, so any advice would be great, please use small words with as much detail as you can because your reading the words of a dummy! ;)
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Dec 17, 2014, 3:54 PM
Post #2 of 12
(2100 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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You are on the right track. Fast turn signals mean a bulb or problem with one or more for any reason but much more likely in this case where you already found a ground that helped to recheck that, add another if you can body to frame (ask for a length of ground strap with eyelet ends) and probably better testing with a test light rather than a volt meter as the volts you mentioned really don't add up or not fast enough if while checking a "blinking" wire to a light.
Same deal any which way but if this is a custom made thing on an E-350 chassis there could be some differences in exact bulb and lenses. How many should light for a turn signal? High chances are the bulbs for parking or also called running lights are a separate filament inside the same bulb with the brighter directional, brake and flasher filament. Bulbs must be right, socket must be right also and of course all well grounded. As said adding ground straps harmlessly body to frame really can't hurt and only help. Those are all throughout vehicles frequently just bare braided wire in places and do break, corrode or missing sometimes in certain situations.
Problem already fixed for the dimmer running/parking light so think it may just need more or socket bulb that matches the bulb #s that work on the other side if in question,
T
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jeepdave
New User
Dec 17, 2014, 9:22 PM
Post #4 of 12
(2087 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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Thanks men. I'll double check my wire to ensure that I'm chasing the correct color wire. But I had followed the wire from the socket:
Multi- function bulb (two dimples):
Green wire to socket is stamped on the wire tail light, and operates my running light...verified by turning on running lights and checking that socket wire with a meter. 12 volts.
Brown wire to socket is labeled right trn and I can visually trace the wire in the loom under rear bumper...branches off to trailer plug ( for towing) from there it runs on the drivers side frame rail to a connector just rear of rear axle... ( checked voltage here on both sides of pin connection) need a test light. This connection has provisions for both rear light clusters and the ground is located here. Then a single brown wire continues by itself forward in the frame rail toward the front of the vehicle. At which point it passes through a grommet in the floor just behind the drivers seat. Then I lose the wire (very tight space here). I removed the running board cover and side cover by entry and fuse box to see if wire was ran there but nope...well there is a tight grouping of wires in a solid cased loom (like heavy duty tape real shiny not wrapped electrical tape but rather a huge hard shrink tube) so it may be in there.
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Dec 17, 2014, 9:51 PM
Post #5 of 12
(2086 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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jeepdave: What is this thing other than the chassis of a Ford Econoline E-350? I've seen (not worked on) this used as a camper, cargo something, passenger bus, ambulance and more including specialty handicapped vehicles. "Fleetwood Tioga" doesn't ring a bell as a Ford name but rather some custom something so I don't know what type of lighting it ended up with? It flashes too fast on one side so you know it's that's side lacking something.
If all NON FORD in the back IDK how to know what might have been done to make lighting street legal?
T
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Dec 17, 2014, 9:57 PM
Post #6 of 12
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Re: turn signal issue
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jeepdave again: You posted while I was typing. Yes you need a test light more than a voltmeter. If you are seeing marked wires for what they are for in English that's not what FORD would do but the coach maker. Not sure of any standard for colors of wires for non OE things if so. Trailer wiring if OE by Ford would likely be some standard and doubt that (can't know) would be used for the vehicle itself,
T
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Dec 18, 2014, 3:04 AM
Post #7 of 12
(2076 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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All I can tell you is in the Ford E350, the brown wire is tail lights, not turn signals.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Dec 18, 2014, 3:06 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Dec 18, 2014, 6:37 AM
Post #8 of 12
(2065 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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Totally agree HT. My trouble is what the heck this thing is? TMK was sold as a chassis to a coach maker to make a motor home! Wild assorted sizes and features and appears nothing behind the nose of a E-350 (body parts of any kind) are left just a chassis that holds specified load.
Finally looked it up by name given on first post. Ford didn't make anything but the base frame - I think. The most common was a camper lots longer, wider and taller than anything mass produced which would require all kinds of extra lights.
I'll try for a sample pic of what this could be>>>>
^^^^^^ Pic was there.
The VERY few I got snagged into looking at (finished) as a camper would or could have a plywood panel with what looks like a real makeshift mess of wires and fuses, switches and more covered by something to make it look neat but was mostly hardware store and any RV place assorted contraptions, wires, crimp connections and a paper on plexiglass with some attempt to say what was for what on plain copied paper! Nice!
No doubt the creations had to meet DOT specs for lighting from rear, sides and top. I can't know what in this case FORD left a bare chassis with to create this type of thing probably some specs given by the coach maker who in turn has already designed what will go where and how.
More of a headache is what if the thing was ever fixed from some accident or damage? Oh my - the headache gets worse!
T
(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Dec 18, 2014, 6:48 AM)
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jeepdave
New User
Dec 18, 2014, 8:16 AM
Post #9 of 12
(2055 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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That picture is exactly what I'm working on. Thanks a bunch for those schematics...those will come in handy no matter what the color is! Which still may not be brown...as mad as I was getting, I could have been poking the drive shift swearing that it was a brake wire...
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jeepdave
New User
Dec 18, 2014, 8:31 AM
Post #10 of 12
(2050 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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Also why that drawing and info about wire color helps me is that I will now know what color from the FORD system to look for from the fuse box...which is from the manufacturer. That will help in finding where RV company hacked into wire to run there mess of wires.
Worse case scenario, if you both feel that this is a solution, this rv is a work vehicle. I will find the wire operating the front right turn signal and tap into it and run a new wire to the back of the coach.
I build large steam and gas turbines for GE and need this rv while I'm driving all over the country, so it's necessity rather than looks. So if tapping into the front right wire will work to run it to the back, that's what I'll do.
(This post was edited by jeepdave on Dec 18, 2014, 8:32 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Dec 18, 2014, 9:02 AM
Post #11 of 12
(2047 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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jeepdave: Worst thing is when you get mad is to keep working on it. Take a walk. Machines and things don't care how you feel whatsoever.
OK - you have the diagram for what would come with an E-350. In the heavy duty truck and van vehicles what you run into is what the end maker did with what they bought so know that FORD didn't do the rest of the vehicle but did have it in mind that it would be intended as a road/street legal something and would be sold prepped for that.
The companies that make the rest of it do come and go and no chance have the wild engineering that car makers would for every assorted thing made out of a legal chassis which would be horribly expensive to design by the coach maker in this case.
Think - will it be a fleet of busses, campers, ambulances and so on. You see these as U-Haul by name quite like so many that you could get total parts and diagrams for what the company did to one.
It just open up room for lack of any exact part #s for things. So - I'm going on that it once worked and the trouble now is where the fault is as you are working to find.
I really thing a plain scratch awl type test light will peg this down. That's like a poking awl with a wire pigtail with an alligator clip on the end and handle lights up. If you power that alligator clip and poke something ground handle will light - got it?
Back to flashing speeds: Flashers do their blinking thing based on the load going thru them. Most go faster some go slower or don't blink at all with assorted faults. It's heating up (usually) a strip of metal that bends when warm from the current going thru it to touch, disconnect and cool and touch again and you get you flashing from that action. Not sure, could be a flasher without moving things inside but same functions.
That's why one side is faster than the other right now and about always come with a light that isn't working properly as well which you did mention. Wrong bulbs can screw things up but not unless problem just started with a new one or just replaced usually.
Said earlier a plain voltmeter isn't as handy as what I described to test for power and ground to find the weak spot or where it drops out.
Things that help are back probing the bulb sockets even using a "T" pin if that makes it easier. Not so fond of but if you sharpen the poking awl real well you can follow a wire to where it loses what you noticed up to where it works. Trouble is you really need to properly seal up any poke holes in wire insulation. I like liquid electrical tape depending on just where if ever need to do that. It's not good to poke wires and ignore them if they ever can get even wet that will ruin the wire eventually.
I'm not a fan of even the best electrical tapes either for exposed wiring to the elements, heat, cold, moisture and so on.
You already mentioned a ground that changed when you working on that. They matter big time as lacking either power or ground for any reason the item is not going to work at all or properly,
Happy hunting at this point I think that's all you can do.
If having trouble using a test light for ground carefully try going from battery positive with jumper cables if you must or a long 12v power port extension they do make or can make one up yourself. It has to be the vehicle's power not just another battery to really get good info and results,
T
T
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Dec 18, 2014, 11:59 AM
Post #12 of 12
(2038 views)
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Re: turn signal issue
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Worse case scenario, if you both feel that this is a solution, this rv is a work vehicle. I will find the wire operating the front right turn signal and tap into it and run a new wire to the back of the coach.
No, no, no, no,no.....................
You'll end up with brake lights in the front and maybe burn something up.
Just test the wire coming out of the turn signal switch and if it works there, follow it back.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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