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turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark


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fat-katie
User

Dec 4, 2021, 11:31 AM

Post #1 of 11 (318 views)
turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

1995 Buick Skylark, 3.1

The turn signals have stopped working. I'd study the schematics in the shop manual but I can't find the flasher in any of them.

The bulbs have all been checked. The fuse is good.

Hazards.
With ignition off or on, the hazard lights flash the rear brake lights but NOT the front.

Turn sigs.
With the ignition on, there is no left or right signal (no 'clicking' sounds - no lights).
With the ignition on AND the hazards on, the turn signals work.

I have two question (unless you already have the solution).

Never Mind. Found it 8A-110-0. #1 To start diagnosing this I have to figure out what drawing has the turn signal circuits. I'm in section 8A and I'll be damned if I can find it. I probably passed right over it.

#2 If any 'flash' funtion works, the flasher is good. Right?

Thank you

(1995 Service Manual, GMP/95-N-2)


(This post was edited by fat-katie on Dec 4, 2021, 11:40 AM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Dec 4, 2021, 1:48 PM

Post #2 of 11 (307 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

THIS INFO I JUST POSTED ISN'T THE TYPE I WAS USED TO BY DIGGING ALL OVER THE WEB. TROUBLE IS THIS AREA OF GM MODELS ARE NOT ALWAYS THE SAME FOR A FEW MODEL YEARS AROUND THIS? VERIFY WHAT YOU HAVE >> ALL USED FLASHERS could be free or mounted in fuse panels? I just can't know.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Sorry to cause confusion if you've already read this it isn't likely this type. I'll remove it if you can tell me/us please....

Is this to say you can't find the flasher? If you can make it work it should click and be felt in hand is listed as a two prong barrel like one that is/was used for many vehicles.


It's cheap enough to just toss it IMO these have moving parts inside/sealed are activated by heat of the electricity thru them on to wiring is really just making it ON/OFF when powered > if there's enough load of the bulbs. You said they checked out as good should be able to see they are intact with hairline wire(s) that when hot are light must be incandescent. If not this would only light and not flash OR rapid flash almost always one side at a time blows bulbs. Most (never say always) will appear dark inside the glass when blown. Rare but possibly not.
Also listed is a relay just for this is seen as squared not rounded like the flasher.


You can test by backprobing a lot of these in this era with a simple test light better if that too is incandescent. The LED ones I know of will usually be two colors for detecting positive or negative (ground) if back powered. Follow me?


IF ANYONE YOU OR ANOTHER HAS TAPPED WIRES FOR SOME OTHER USE DON'T USE THESE.


This is a strange failure to me still have one (my own fleet of creations) with same type of directionals as this should be. In steering column out of sight must remove steering wheel and have proper tools to get thru the locking star wheel.


It's been ages they did bust mostly from abuse now it's plain old. Two springs (left + right handed opposites) cancel the signals many broke such that the spring would fall and make it very erratic. If it cancels that should be good just steer the wheel back like about all vehicles I've ever known cancel the blinking. If not it's already busted??


Say so or not before this gets more confusing to chase down other things that has to be intact for most or this type thing can happen.


Simple yet fussy if problem is there,



(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Dec 4, 2021, 2:13 PM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Dec 4, 2021, 2:16 PM

Post #3 of 11 (295 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

Info by me above I just changed so look back please.
Also say what type of column tilt or not. Tilt bends wires by now is a problem spot to verify also,
Tom


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Dec 4, 2021, 8:24 PM

Post #4 of 11 (275 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

I can't give you a picture because images are not working on the site at the moment.

Both flashers are under the dash on the driver's side.

The turn signal flasher is to the left of the steering column and the hazard flasher is to the right of the column.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



fat-katie
User

Dec 5, 2021, 10:36 AM

Post #5 of 11 (252 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

 
UPDATE: I thought I was being clever. Ahha, it's the hazard switch. Woe is me. The hazard and turn signal switch are the same assembly. The dotted box in the schematic delimits the switch assembly. May have to junk the car. Including below just because I spent time on it.


It appears the hazard switch has, at least, 6 poles. One pole connects thru the turn signal switch and on to the rear lights. With the ignition off they flash. That's one circuit. The hazard flasher is good.

But the fronts hazards don't flash nor do the instrument panel turn indicators... which should. These lights, the turn signal indicator lights and front lights, work in other modes.


That indicates to me the hazard switch is bad, if I'm reading the schematic correctly.

A hazard switch pole connects, in the on position, to the turn signal indicator via a "splice" on the schematic. I interpret this "splice" as indicating that the turn signal switch, the switching mechanism itself, is not in the circuit. It tells me the hazard switch is bad. It's the hardest, minimum interconnections, route I can find here.

All these behaviors are not logical and it seems to me something is going on in one of the switches.

Unless someone has a better idea, I'm going for the hazard switch. I saw a video on the turn signal replacement and that's just a nightmare. You need special tools. I saw an estimate for replacement at $1000.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Dec 5, 2021, 10:48 AM

Post #6 of 11 (250 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

The left and right front turn signals and signal indicators operate from the same switch but different circuits so it's a little strange to lose both sides at once while the rears are working.

You could be right but I would do more testing to see what's coming out of that switch before being sure.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Dec 5, 2021, 11:04 AM

Post #7 of 11 (246 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

Here is the diagram

https://ibb.co/HGZW3rM

[url=https://ibb.co/HGZW3rM]
[url=https://usefulwebtool.com/math-keyboard]math symbols in word



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Dec 5, 2021, 11:07 AM)


fat-katie
User

Dec 14, 2021, 2:37 PM

Post #8 of 11 (154 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

I've changed my focus from the turn signals switch to the multi-function alarm module. I have interior lights that blink off and on, at times, and sometimes do not extinguish at all (as in dead battery and need a jump). I'm working my way thru the schematics.


I just want to be sure I understand this. I make 3 observations below. I can read electronics schematics but these automotive ones are not the same.


Following the dome light circuit.

#1 What I call the dome light (in schematic as courtesy-base) is shown on page 8A-114-4 "Interior Lights: Courtesy (base) Pontiac and Buick.

#2 The dome light is powered from circuit 1732 (see 8A-114-1), the source is the 'Convenience Center' and within that, the 'Muli-Function Alarm Module 'MFAM'. The signal is called 'Switched Battery' and is controlled by the MFAM switch/logic labeled 'Inadvertent Power Control' (???whatever that is).

#3 The dome light is returned to ground thru circuit 156 (inter-page ref 'A' on 8A-114-1) which connects to 3 modules; Panel Dimmer Switch, Remote Keyless Entry and Interior Lamps Control of the MFAM. The dome light dims slowly as it shuts down. I assume this dimming function is accomplished in the Interior Lamps Control of the MFAM.


The dome lights if:
- any door is opened will illuminate 40 seconds or until the ignition is turned on after the door is closed
- illuminates after ignition is turned off and key is removed (exit feature)
- dimmer switch is full left
- there are other particulars...

What I'm going to do.

I don't know the hows and whys of the signal 'Switched Battery' so I'll start at the low end. If I pull the connectors on the Panel Dimmer Switch and the Remote Keyless Entry Module and the lights keeps coming on, the problem originates in the MFAM (assuming no shorting wires). If it does I'd pull the MFAM and work the door inputs (assuming you can pull individual connector pins). Disconnecting the doors should end all lighting. If not, then it's the MFAM.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Dec 14, 2021, 3:02 PM

Post #9 of 11 (152 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

This is not going to be easy to track down. These lights can be triggered from any one of a dozen or so different triggers.

They work by applying ground so a short in any one of these harnesses to ground will do this.
My experience is that when there is a module involved, it's usually the first suspect.

I would probably first unplug the module and isolate whether this issue is module and door switch related or one of the other switches causing it.

PS, There is no point referring to page numbers for me because I am not looking at the same source you are.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



fat-katie
User

Dec 16, 2021, 2:28 PM

Post #10 of 11 (122 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

It's cold and snowing so it's not hard to take your hint that finding this will be tuff and not attempt it. So I have pulled all the courtesy bulbs and stuck an "under cabinet", battery powered 'click' light by the now absent dome light. Wife is ok with it.

I looked online for this muti-function alarm module, and, of course, it's no longer available. The junkyard crushed the 1995 Skylark they had so I blew that.

Here's the GM part number 16231519. I found one in England for $300+. lol

TWO QUESTIONS

#1. Is there a good place to look for this part? I don't have any inside info and just rely on duck.

#2. Can a schematic of this module be obtained? I feel like I could repair it, if it's needed, if I had it. The shop manuals have only a logical presentations.

Thank you. This should do it until next summer. Thanks again.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Dec 16, 2021, 2:36 PM

Post #11 of 11 (119 views)
Re: turn signals stopped working; 1995 Skylark Sign In

You probably won't find a new one but I bet you could find a used one somewhere.
I think finding an internal schematic would be hopeless too.

Just a note, removing all the bulbs may not solve your problem. If that module is staying active, it will still kill your battery.

I would put the bulbs back in and disconnect the module. That should give you interior lights through switches but not the doors.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Dec 16, 2021, 2:37 PM)






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