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railguy
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Oct 26, 2012, 4:51 PM
Post #1 of 20
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ball bearing in pan
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Hi,I just joined the site.My son has a 93 fullsize Blazer for a first vehicle.We'er haveing problems wiht the trans,a 4L60e.It dose'nt slip but shifts slow with the RPM's going up between shifts.I toke the pan off and didn't see anything out of the ordenary except a ball bearing,a little smaller than a 1/4 inch.the trans shop fells pretty sure it's a check valve ball.dose anyone know where I can find a manual or online diagram of the trans so I can repear it myself.
thanks railguy
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Oct 26, 2012, 6:14 PM
Post #2 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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Transmission probably needs to be rebuilt. A check ball in the pan probably means the separator plate is worn out or a case ball popped out. You'll have to remove the valve body and see where the check ball came from and inspect the separator plate.
Valve body check ball locations:
Case ball locations:
Ball getting ready to pop out of a worn separator plate ball hole:
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Oct 26, 2012, 6:23 PM)
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railguy
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Oct 26, 2012, 6:56 PM
Post #3 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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Can you tell me where to get a manual on the 4L60E trans.
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Oct 26, 2012, 7:07 PM
Post #4 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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There is transmission service information at ALLDATADIY.
ATSG also sells a manual for overhauling and diagnosing that transmission.
There is also another ATSG manual for updates to the transmission because there were so many of them.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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railguy
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Nov 2, 2012, 3:19 PM
Post #5 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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Transmission probably needs to be rebuilt. A check ball in the pan probably means the separator plate is worn out or a case ball popped out. You'll have to remove the valve body and see where the check ball came from and inspect the separator plate. Valve body check ball locations: Case ball locations: Ball getting ready to pop out of a worn separator plate ball hole:
I dropped the pan and the valve body.In the valve body there was one ball missing,it was one of the two that are together.I can't see how it got out as it will not fit through any of the holes.When I removed the seperater plate one ball was up in the trans,were it the other was lying on the seporater plate.Any help will be appreciated.
railguy
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MarineGrunt
Enthusiast
Nov 2, 2012, 4:56 PM
Post #6 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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I can't be of any help with your problem but wanted to say that the ATSG manual is a great manual when rebuilding your tranny. I'm in the process of rebuilding my first and have never even been inside a tranny until now. It gives step by step with pictures and seems to cover almost everything. I don't know how much of a help it would be trying to diagnose a problem but it's great if you plan on going through a tranny on your own.
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Nov 2, 2012, 5:18 PM
Post #7 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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The two check balls in the middle eh? Are you positive one didn't slip through the separator plate. In the picture below if a middle check ball where to get through the plate it will follow the exhaust passage out and land in the pan. Be sure the ball hole in the plate is the right one your inspecting. The only other logical explanation is someone had it apart before and got the ball located wrong.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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railguy
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Nov 2, 2012, 5:47 PM
Post #8 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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The two check balls in the middle eh? Are you positive one didn't slip through the separator plate. In the picture below if a middle check ball where to get through the plate it will follow the exhaust passage out and land in the pan. Be sure the ball hole in the plate is the right one your inspecting. The only other logical explanation is someone had it apart before and got the ball located wrong. I'm pretty sure but I'll check again tomorrow.Also when I took the seporater plate off "with the trany still in the Blazer"I just droped it strait down One ball the one closest to the center, stayed up in the trans like it can't come out while the other came down on the plate. Is that right? thanks railguy |
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
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Nov 2, 2012, 6:19 PM
Post #9 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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There is only one free check ball that goes up in the channel plate.
There are a total of 10 check balls. Two of the them are inside retainers and pressed in. They shouldn't come out. The free one in the channel plate and seven in the valve body.
***Another thing you have to be careful about is that you put the valve body bolts back in the right places. There are a couple that are longer than the others. If you put a long bolt in a short hole you can bind up the sun shell, which is a bad thing.***
Location of the #1 check ball in the channel plate:
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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railguy
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Nov 2, 2012, 6:43 PM
Post #10 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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A few months ago The case of this trans broke.I took it out and took it to a trans shop,were a technician changed everything over to another case.There was a shaft bent which he replaced.And a few other things he replaced but the trans had just been re built.Maybe he got the ball in the wrong place like you said.But the trans worked fine for months?
The ball thats missing or miss placed would that cause the trans to shift slow?
Thanks railguy
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
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Nov 2, 2012, 6:55 PM
Post #11 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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It is possible. I don't know the exact symptoms of what would happen if one of the two center balls were missing. I'm not much of a transmission tech to be honest. It could cause a loss of pressure in the circuit it is designed to operate in when another circuit is activated. The loss of pressure could cause a shift flare. Really the only way to find out if that will cure the problem is to put it back together with the balls in the right place and see how it works. If it doesn't work still, your going to need to take it to a transmission shop for evaluation.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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railguy
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Nov 2, 2012, 7:09 PM
Post #12 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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Have you ever used alldata?Was thinking of buying it for a year since the Blazer is 20 years old.Is it very useful?I mean how extencive or complete is it?I bought a manual for the Blazer 93-03 and it didn't tell me anything.I don't want to do that again.
Thanks railguy
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
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Nov 2, 2012, 7:18 PM
Post #13 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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Our shop uses Motor3k which is powered by Alldata. Alldata is a whole lot better than Haynes or Chilton by a long run. It isn't as complete as the factory service manuals, but it is really close.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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railguy
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Nov 2, 2012, 7:21 PM
Post #14 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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Thanks
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railguy
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Nov 3, 2012, 2:42 PM
Post #15 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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this part fell out,I didn't see where it came from.do you know?javascript: addTag(':/')
http://www.transmissionpartsusa.com/700R4_4L60E_Transmission_Screen_Filter_p/350-00035330d.htm
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Nov 3, 2012, 5:34 PM
Post #16 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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When you inspect your separator plate ball holes, be sure they aren't worn out. If they are worn, the balls won't seal or could get stuck on the plate.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Nov 3, 2012, 5:51 PM)
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railguy
User
Nov 3, 2012, 5:50 PM
Post #17 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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Thanks again
railguy
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railguy
User
Nov 30, 2012, 4:43 PM
Post #18 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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The Auto is gone.I put a NV3500 Manual.So I have a few more questions.First the switch for the Transfer case That sends a signal to the front end to engage the 4 wh drive only has 2 wires"it's from a 91"where my old one has 3 wires.I need to know what the middle "blue" wire is for.Next the idle is running high 1500 rpm but setteling down eventually.Makes it kinda hard to shift.It's electronic throttle body injection.Can the computer be recoded for the manual trans?I also have the computer from the truck the NV3500 came out of.The transfer case came out of another truck.The clutch, presure plate and fly wheel came from still another one.The wires for the 4l60e are still there I didn't do anything with them.Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks railguy
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Nov 30, 2012, 7:25 PM
Post #19 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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hmmm...this thing sounds like a mongrel now.
Not sure how an automatic configured PCM would react to a manual transmission. I guess the PCM is seeing all kinds of issues now since the PRDNL, shift solenoids, PWM, pressure switches, and TCC solenoids are all gone. You really need an ECM for a manual now and you'll need the correct PROM, but not sure if that would connect to the existing computer harness. It's not something we run into very often.
What color are the other two wires? The transfer case switch only has two wires ( light blue and brown).
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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railguy
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Nov 30, 2012, 8:14 PM
Post #20 of 20
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Re: ball bearing in pan
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I'm not sure I think there's a teal?and brown? on the out side and blue in the middle.I checked with my ohm meter and the 2 out side wires got continuewity between them when in 4h and 2h.but I couldn't see where the middle one did any thing.I checked all combinations even to ground.
My son just told me it idled like that before when it was cold but straightened out when warm.So for now I'm just going to chaulk that up to being 20 yrs old.A guy I know changed his over 9 yrs ago And hasn't had any problems.He said he did it himself but I think he had more help then he's admitting to.
My son wants to trade it in for a small car.I told him since I'm paying for all this cause he's just 17.I'll give him the down payment in exchange for the Blazer but he has to get a job and make the payments.Now I'm always tell him to take care of it cause its going to be mine some day.Which is fine with him cause he knows that he be able use it any time wants.
I paid $700 for 2 NV3500's And everything to change it over including the transfer case.Another
$50 for a fly wheel clutch and presure plate from another yard.
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